Is buying a part finished project worthwhile?

[Bill Shields]

That's a serious inspection hole in the boiler

[SCBryan]

I purchased my partially completed 1-1/2' Heisler (a scaled up Kozo design) several years ago from a man who could not continue it due to illness. Most of his work was very good. Some was not so good. Being my first steam engine project, it has been a good learning experience. In retrospect, I think I probably overpaid for the project. Although I had very little machining experience, I have the luxury of having professional tool makers that I can ask when I get stumped. Solving issues has taught me a lot. That being said, I don't think I would purchase another partially completed project.

Steve

[tetramachine]

I have purchased two projects, first was a very poorly built 1" Pacific unfinished. Came a new steel boiler, beautiful brass riveted tender 90% done, the loco was build by a person with a file, and bent ruler he couldn't read. Example, the wheels were loose on the axles, filled in with bondo, really.

But with the price I paid $2k, the price was ok for the parts and well completed work.

The second project was a well worn Pacific same as the first project. Damaged pushrods and cylinder. I replaced the bushing, bored the damaged cylinder, made piston and rings. It is now a runner. Happy with results,

It really depends on the price paid for the project, vs work completed.

[Greg_Lewis]

I think it's also dependent on what you like to do in the hobby. For example, I'm not a runner — my most fun times are when I'm trying to figure out how to make the part and then to making it. I was sort of let down when I finished the frame and running gear for my engine because all the fun of making those parts was over. OTOH, many hobbyists want to get a locomotive done and on the track; and some aren't at all interested in building but in running. So for me a partially completed engine would not be what I want but for others it would be a good way to get into the hobby or to take on a different kind of challenge.

[gwrdriver]

I think it's also dependent on what you like to do in the hobby. For example, I'm not a runner — my most fun times are when I'm trying to figure out how to make the part and then to making it.

That's me also.

[James Powell]

Dad's gone down a few rabbit holes over the years- the worst (bar none) was the Marshal in 3" that the owner wanted dad to make run. All the parts individually were OK. But not one would fit...the cylinder block (UK style traction engine, where it is mounted direct to boiler) couldn't be made to sit perpendicular to the crank, for example. (as in, neither the valve face or cylinder...and I suspect they weren't II either !).

On the other hand, I know dad had a lot of fun reworking the Shelmedine engine-
DSCN2245 by Peach James, on Flickr
Which has much wrong with it, but much which got left wrong as "make it kind of go" was the remit.

There have been times when I have despaired at the amount of time dad has spent working on someone else's junk. If stuff is fairly well made, then taking on someone else's project can be a enjoyable way to start from something. But, if it is horribly made to begin with, then it quickly becomes a fools game of trying to make something good from something bad.

I suspect I have handed dad a bit of that- in that the Britannia I have likely has more wrong with the chassis than the nominal builder (Harry Boneham) would have passed as good. I know he didn't build the chassis, and I have some suspicions about what is wrong with it. (wheels with different crank pin radius'...) While there are "dodges" which can be done to locos- the Caribou here at work has some valve gear parts which dad "stretched" to fit...there are others where there is no good final cure. Steam engines can be very forgiving to get to run, but as size decreases, the tolerance to get a running model which will pull you gets smaller. Oftentimes, it is the experience of someone who has done it before that is more important than the simple ability of the person to get to ultra precision machining. The advances which have happened in home measuring and machining (CAM, the relative lower cost of precision tooling) have made it much easier to make a model which will run, as has the gradual sizing up of models. It's far easier to get a ride behind a 3/4" pacific than a 1/2" one...and if you can't ride behind a 1 1/2" railway engine, then goodness alone help you.

The list of other peoples projects that dad has finished start in about what? 1973 or so, and continue to date. Sometimes, by the time he's done, there hasn't been much left of the other peoples work...the roller has its original rolls, and some gearing left...but that's it. New boiler. New Cylinder (x2, IIRC), new tender (x2), new pipework, new chimney ring, new headstock (for the quadrant steering)...ya, not much left there any more...

RollerV3 (1) by Peach James, on Flickr
(that's in the mid 1990's, in extensive rebuild #2)

James

[RET]

Hi Dave,

There are a number of factors. First, as has been mentioned, it depends a lot on the quality and accuracy of the work that has already been done. Second, it also depends on the buyer's ability (often with helpful advice) to evaluate the completed work. And third, is it a project that you are willing to take on and have the skills and equipment to finish?

In my case, I have been very lucky (Don has also got me involved in some of my projects). I had Harry Hawkins as a friend and mentor and he was a good builder. The 3 1/2" gauge Boston and Albany 4-6-6T was a project he started but was unable to finish for health reasons. I bought it from him (the hard work had already been done) and finished it to a good running state. It was wonderful to see Harry's eyes light up when Don and I brought the finished locomotive to his house to show him.

Later, Harry told me about Dart (a 7 1/4" gauge 0-4-2T) and suggested that I should get it (an estate sale). I saw that it was a VERY well built chassis with a commercially built copper boiler and I was lucky to get it. All the necessary castings were included in the purchase.

Finally, in September, 2005, Don & I purchased the 3 1/2" gauge Big Boy. Gerhardt Kuhnt of Sarnia did a lot of very fine work on it over five years but he was unable to finish it because he got alzheimers and died in 2005. I have done a lot of work on the locomotive, but there is still a lot left to do.

So if you are lucky enough to be able to acquire an unfinished locomotive that is well built and you have the skill and experience (or the good advice) to know what you are seeing and you have the tools, machines and ability to carry on with the work that has been done, "go for it."

In all this, my guiding principle has been to make sure that anything I do to the model (Boston & Albany, Dart or Big Boy) has to be at least as good as the work that has a;ready been done by my predecessors. I owe it to them.

Richard Trounce.

[FKreider]

Depends on the work that the preowner did

I would agree with this, some projects I have looked at are not much more than a pile of scrap. If you have to re-work the whole thing down to the frames then what is the point?

The exception of course being that you are purchasing the whole project but are really only after certain parts and pieces to start or finish your own project (for example- cylinder castings, completed tender, etc. etc.)

[David Powell]

One of my success stories involves a Hoffman Hudson in 3 1/2 inch gauge. Bought sight unseen as part of a friend.s bigger deal. It arrived, literally in a couple of bushel baskets. There was a brand new steel boiler, a set of brass frames, apparently " Machined" with an angle grinder and bastard file, wheels " fitted" on axles of varying gauges and a pair of cylinders, reasonably machined BUT with piston valves about 3/8 in diameter. and some loose bits and castings. Six months of spare time produced a good powerful loco( No tender) which ran passenger pulling at Richmond Hill until another member made me an offer I could not refuse, and he built a tender, fitted cosmetic streamlining and ran it for several years until his untimely death. I seem to remember paying about $ 350 cdn, ie far less than the castings cost new'
So from some beginners badly executed effort, which likely would have been scrapped by many,
there is now a good looking loco which runs well.
If you count it as " paying Work" well I would have made more as a Walmart greeter, but it rates high on my list of " Had fun, was successful and satisfactory for a new owner".
Regards David Powell.

[David Powell]

I have started on another rebuild project while waiting on delivery of a set of brand new castings.
I got the project as an exchange item. IT is a 2 inch scale Clayton steam wagon. The boiler tested out fine, apparently never steamed. BUT the engine !! so far I have remachined the trunk guides. replaced the cylinder covers, made new crossheads, piston rods and pistons, gland nuts, refaced the valve face, replaced the glands om the valve chest
So far I would have been far quickerto have started with new castings, and would have a better job.. But it has only cost me a few bits of material from my stock.
I will keep you informed of progress or the lack of it !
Regards David Powell

[David Powell]

Well , now over a month later and I am still working on that engine. It has had a new slide shaft, new crankshaft, one new crankshaft bearing, one connecting rod built up and remachined, a lot of new fasteners made from hex bar, still a lot more to go.
I definitely will finish it, but it will be my last rebuild of a dud. Amateurs really should build a simple engine and boier first before spoiling good castings and parts of complex models.
Regards David Powell,

[baggo]

Is it one built from a Winson kit? It certainly sounds like one. A lot of the machining on the kits was pretty dire!

John