looking for positive suggestions

[tater1337]

I have two walk behind tractors, one I restored and one next on the to-do list

while looking for help on making parts to fix one of the tractors, I stumbles across Keith Appletons youtube series about live steam model engines (he does a lot of hobby lathe and milling, so it was useful)

so anyway, I was showing some of his stuff and someone came to the wrong assumptions that I wanted to build a STEAM powered walk behind tractor

no.no, no,just wanted to know how to lathe brass bushings, and he has a nice voice and pleasing demeanor

well after a year of this misconception, the idea is kinda growing on me.

goals
two axle walk behind or ride-behind tractor. maybe stand behind.
steam powered, wood fueled, preferably wood pellet fuel or some other renewable fuel
practical design versus a scale model replica of some existing full scale
a non oil-loss lubricant setup
able to navigate the handicapped access of the makerspace where it is build (my walk behinds can do this)
able to mount standard implements and have enough power to use them

pro's
one of a kind tractor, fully documented
all hand built, so the skills to make one are the same skills to repair/replace parts
should be eternal if not harvested by a scrapyard
multi fuel capabilities
most of the system modular, incase we accidentally undersize one aspect(too low HP, not enough steam volume, etc)
simplify by building on a c channel/u channel frame
steel wheels vs pneumatic tires

Cons
most live steam modelers will hate me, as not historically/scale/esthetically accurate
yet another chunk of metal, money, and time when I am running out of each of those resources
already have a to-do list that is too full, and fellow makerspace members already concerned with space I am occupying with pending projects
no easy design criteria
poor safety reputation (the steam engine, not me!)

[Pontiacguy1]

I would suggest that you try to adapt the cylinders/engine off of the Maynard Cli-Shay locomotive, and maybe scale them up some if you need to get more power. The book Building the Cli-Shay would be a good reference. It is a vertical boiler locomotive, but I would probably use a regular fire-tube type boiler instead of the water tube original boiler. It could be a decent solution for you, at least it's somewhere I might would start to look. It was also all fabricated, no castings to build the cylinders/engine assembly.

[Bill Shields]

you could build the steam part from a twin cylinder boat engine -> similar to a Crescent ?

seem to remember something like 3" bore, 4" stroke....

or maybe a set of cylinders from a Stanley Steamer.

Jay Leno may be convinced to part with a set....

[apm]

I have been thinking that this will likely be my next project. I have built a live steam locomotive but now living a long way from the nearest club by the time that one loads, drives, unloads, steams up, runs, loads drive, unload, it's a lot of work and you really need the whole weekend.

I am thinking a steam tractor with a mower deck would be the coldest thing if for no other reason than to be the only guy cutting his grass with a coal fired steam engine in the neighborhood! How nice would it be to just fire up on a Sunday run for an hour cut the grass and put it back away.

Right now my thoughts are to make something that looks kind of like an Avery traction engine. I am thinking of taking some of the RMI steamdome and smoke box casings and going with a 10" boiler barrel to stay under the hobby boiler codes.

I have an old engine off a Locomobile steam car that needs done fixing that could probably be my motive power. The bigger part I wonder is my actual mower engine. I know my lawn mower is over 5HP and it seems to still bog down. I wonder if there's enough power in steam to cut grass?

If that fails I am also thinking maybe I can go with the old fashioned spinning wheel style grass cutters. Still thinking it all thru and I have one more project in front of it but by all means go for it and post progress.

I am surprised that traction and boats aren't more popular in the hobby as there's a lot more places to run those than locomotives.

[318J]

apm, if you wanted to take it a step farther you could get or build a real steam lawn mower. There's a few still around I've seen at traction shows.

Teddy Roosevelt even used them to cut the White House's lawn.

I know that's not the premise of what you're going for- making a homemade one would probably be a lot more fun!

[Bill Shields]

It takes a fair amount of HP to drive a grass cutting blade.

Our bush hog sucks up a fair amount of the 40+ HP at the rear PTO.

Honestly...it would be a curiosity the first couple of times you used it....then gathering cobwebs

[apm]

apm, if you wanted to take it a step farther you could get or build a real steam lawn mower. There's a few still around I've seen at traction shows.

Teddy Roosevelt even used them to cut the White House's lawn.

I know that's not the premise of what you're going for- making a homemade one would probably be a lot more fun!

s-l500.jpg

I have seen one of these at Kinzers but everyone knows that proper steam engines aee meant run on coal or why bother! I don't see any way for coal firing in that design.


Bill I have such a concern but have been wondering if a reel mower would be the way to go. Could probably power it too with a small PM Research engine. Far from being a curiosity I think it could be a whole lot of fun. If one made the mower deck removable it would also be fun to drive around as a traction engine and could go to shows etc... The big question would be whether to do prototypical chain steering or go to rack and pinion.

[Bill Shields]

Ah...I was envisioning something like a walk behind with the hog out front.

Feeding such a beast on wood will require many cords of cellulose.....

I'm too old to even think about it as manageable...a herd of goats is more my speed for this aspect of life once my wife decides she no longer wants to do it.

[NP317]

A propane fired boiler would make the mowing machine much easier to use by one person.
All controls can be wherever the operator is.

I'm a long-time scales aficionado, but I heartily endorse any steam operating machines.
"Make it so."
RussN

[tater1337]

welp, visiting relatives on holidays so i cannot give you some good pics, but I want this post to keep moving


but I think I can post the video of the walk behind I restored. it uses between a 3-6hp motor

so this withOUT the sulky, with a front axle, and a boiler and steam engine to replace the gas engine

supposedly the 3hp can pull a single 6" bottom plow, a 5hp can pull a 8"(i seriously doubt)

[David Powell]

The engine is not the problem, A twin cylinder slide valve job, about 2 inch bore and stroke revving at 800 to 1000 rpm ought to give you enough power and torque to match most small lawnmowers, even light duty garden tractors.
However, to get enough hot steam at about 100 lbs pressure( At the engine) to run steadily you need a fairly large free steaming boiler, with a working pressure of 125 to 150 lbs,
IF you fire with wood or coal you will need a big grate area, perhaps 50 sq inches to avoid firing very frequently.
Small boilered steam plants are great fun, as models, but getting much actual work out of them is hard going on those running them.
Do not let these comments dismay you, Work out your ideas on paper, use a bit of theory, follow it with practical building/ buying of suitable engine and boiler units. Then once you have a complete outfit have lots of safe fun trying it out, modifying it as experience dictates and when you are happy then nothing will wipe the smile off your face.
i am still having fun after 60 yrs of " Playing"
Regards David Powell.

[tater1337]

However, to get enough hot steam at about 100 lbs pressure( At the engine) to run steadily you need a fairly large free steaming boiler, with a working pressure of 125 to 150 lbs,
IF you fire with wood or coal you will need a big grate area, perhaps 50 sq inches to avoid firing very frequently.

Well dang it, I was planning a boiler with a 12x12 footprint,but I guess I'll go smaller IF I HAVE TO

We was looking at wood pellets to have continuous fueling but that would be a new factor to add math to...but since they push enought BTUs to keep a house warm, a couple 2x2 pistons shouldn't be harder to push