Why are these springs necessary
Moderators: Glenn Brooks, Harold_V
Forum rules
Topics may include: antique park gauge train restoration, preservation, and history; building new grand scale equipment from scratch; large scale miniature railway construction, maintenance, and safe operation; fallen flags; track, gauge, and equipment standards; grand scale vendor offerings; and, compiling an on-line motive power roster.
Topics may include: antique park gauge train restoration, preservation, and history; building new grand scale equipment from scratch; large scale miniature railway construction, maintenance, and safe operation; fallen flags; track, gauge, and equipment standards; grand scale vendor offerings; and, compiling an on-line motive power roster.
-
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:49 am
- Location: Concord ,NH / Naples, Fl
Why are these springs necessary
Hi All, I have redesigned an switch mechanism that seems to work well, still may need a bit of refinement but the question would be why are the springs necessary in the before pics, my arrangement makes a positive closure of the switch points in both directions,
Thoughts
Thoughts
If it ain’t broken keep working on it until it is .
Geo
Geo
Re: Why are these springs necessary
You had a spring switch that enabled one to drive thru the turnout from the divergent without throwing the switch. You have also made it really hard to tell which way the switch has been thrown as you approach with the horizontal throw handle.
3/4" Juliet II 0-4-0
3/4" Purinton Mogul "Pogo"
3/4" Hall Class 10 wheeler
3/4" Evans Caribou/Buffalo 2-8-0
3/4" Sweet Violet 0-4-0
3/4" Hunslet 4-6-0
3/4" Kozo A3. Delayed construction project
1 1/2" A5 Camelback 0-4-0
3/4" Purinton Mogul "Pogo"
3/4" Hall Class 10 wheeler
3/4" Evans Caribou/Buffalo 2-8-0
3/4" Sweet Violet 0-4-0
3/4" Hunslet 4-6-0
3/4" Kozo A3. Delayed construction project
1 1/2" A5 Camelback 0-4-0
-
- Posts: 1572
- Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:15 am
- Location: Tennessee, USA
Re: Why are these springs necessary
Yes, springs are used so that you can trail through the switch without derailing, no matter which way the points are set. This is really useful in some yard areas, passing sidings on bi-directional mainlines, and turnaround loops where you have a point-to-point layout. Some places I have known have used positive throw points like what you have. They work, but in this hobby most people expect to be able to trail through a switch without throwing it, so there will be some derailments by visitors and newcomers until they get used to having to get off and throw the switch every time.
-
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:49 am
- Location: Concord ,NH / Naples, Fl
Re: Why are these springs necessary
I am new to this, what does it mean to be “trailing through a switch?
If it ain’t broken keep working on it until it is .
Geo
Geo
-
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:49 am
- Location: Concord ,NH / Naples, Fl
Re: Why are these springs necessary
I found my answer on Trailing through a switch.
If it ain’t broken keep working on it until it is .
Geo
Geo
-
- Posts: 1572
- Joined: Thu Apr 26, 2012 10:15 am
- Location: Tennessee, USA
Re: Why are these springs necessary
When you build a switch with the springs in it to move the points, I.E. a Sprung switch, you need to be careful about how stiff you make your springs. if they are too stiff, then lighter cars will end up derailing instead of moving the points over and running through the switch. If they are too light, then the switch will tend to not move all the way over into the proper position when you throw it, especially if it has a lack of lubrication or a little bit of dirt or tree sap or whatever in it that might make it want to stick.
- Bill Shields
- Posts: 10589
- Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 4:57 am
- Location: 39.367, -75.765
- Contact:
Re: Why are these springs necessary
Welcome to the world of model railroading
Too many things going on to bother listing them.
Re: Why are these springs necessary
No need to belabor the discussion regarding "trailing thru" a turnout. Yes...you need this. However, George, in addition to having a switch throw mechanism that is visible and indicates the direction of travel when facing the turnout..would urge you to consider the use of non-ferrous switch throw components that will not rust or provide problematic operation.
At my home track, the switch throw mechanisms are for the most part made with aluminum and stainless steel components. Yes, a little more expensive, but the club gets that investment back in very reliable switch operation. The value of smooth operating turnouts is...PRICELESS!
Years ago when I was track co-chair and chair, members were threatened with bodily harm if they were EVER... caught them with an oil can "oiling around" a turnout. The oil attracts grime, ballast dust and basically gums up the operation. Negatively impacting the operation of the turnout no matter which direction train traffic is moving. Mother Nature was left to clean the movable parts of the switch and switch throw when it rained.
Keep on switching! Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
-
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:49 am
- Location: Concord ,NH / Naples, Fl
Re: Why are these springs necessary
Hi, this was an experiment to make the switches operate with less parts, ie springs, this turn out directs cars into a storage shed that is seldom used, we are well aware of the corrosion situation.
If it ain’t broken keep working on it until it is .
Geo
Geo
- Bill Shields
- Posts: 10589
- Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 4:57 am
- Location: 39.367, -75.765
- Contact:
Re: Why are these springs necessary
less parts all seems like a good idea until someone runs through the closed switch and derails and entire train full of cars and or damages the switch because something is now bent
the, all of a sudden -> that $4 spring seems like a good idea.
the, all of a sudden -> that $4 spring seems like a good idea.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.
-
- Posts: 2930
- Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:39 pm
- Location: Woodinville, Washington
Re: Why are these springs necessary
Wondering if Anybody here has tried to use return springs with 12 pound rail, with switches made from 12 pound rail , say 12” or 15” inch gauge?
Would this design work at these larger gauges?
Thanks,
Glenn
Would this design work at these larger gauges?
Thanks,
Glenn
Moderator - Grand Scale Forum
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge
Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....
-
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:49 am
- Location: Concord ,NH / Naples, Fl
Re: Why are these springs necessary
It seems to me that the real reason for the springs is to prevent a derailment if a train is going into a turnout in the wrong direction , do real railroads have these devices?Bill Shields wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 8:14 am less parts all seems like a good idea until someone runs through the closed switch and derails and entire train full of cars and or damages the switch because something is now bent
the, all of a sudden -> that $4 spring seems like a good idea.
If it ain’t broken keep working on it until it is .
Geo
Geo