Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

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Rich_Carlstedt
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Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Rich_Carlstedt » Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:48 pm

I am interested in having the Walschaert's outside admission program help me design the valve layout for my Chloe, instead of using the ordinary Stephenson gear.
A few questions.
Can I input my known dimensions and have it develop the other needed dims ?
Obviously I only have half the points like stroke and center heights.
It seems like it wants all dims , and if I had that, I wouldn't need the program?
When I put in what I have the moving picture goes wild and Error flashes on the screen.
When I ask for "Help" with the program, Windows tells me it cannot load the help file.
ALso, is there somewhere that tells me what the dimensions are that I need to measure, like
" Combination Lever Back Set"? or "Valve Exhaust Cavity Rear "
Thoughts ?
Rich

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Dick_Morris
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Dick_Morris » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:29 am

Charlie's program is a simulator, not a design tool. It will allow you to put in your own dimensions to see how your gear performs.

"Locomotive Valves and Valve Gears" by Yoder and Wharren has the information needed to design Walschaert gear. It's available on the Inernet. There is also at least one other program that supports design. I don't remember the details, but it's been described here in the past and a search would find information. I believe it is also available on the Internet.

JJG Koopmans
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by JJG Koopmans » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:07 am

As it is a simulator, I would study the used dimensions and systematically scale them.
In front of each line in the dimension editors there is a button, when clicked it shows the
dimension under consideration in the drawing.
The instruct.doc file is not available in every downloaded part, you have to look for it.
Kind regards
Jos Koopmans

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Fred_V
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Fred_V » Fri Jul 31, 2015 6:54 am

Rich, you will have to sit down and actually draw out the whole valve gear. CAD is the best way to do that. Do you have a CAD program? If so I have an instructional drawing that will assist in drawing up a new design.
Fred V
Pensacola, Fl.

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baggo
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by baggo » Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:07 am

Don Ashton has an Excel spreadsheet for designing Walschaert's gear that you can download from his website:

http://www.donashton.co.uk/html/downloads.html

I've used it many times and it gives excellent results. You still need to input some basic dimensions though before it calculates everything else.

John
Secretary of The National 2½" Gauge Association
Member of North West Liecestershire SME

http://www.modeng.johnbaguley.info

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Rich_Carlstedt
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Rich_Carlstedt » Fri Jul 31, 2015 9:48 am

Wow, 4 wonderful answers !
Thank You John, Fred, Jos and Dick !
I now have a better understanding of what I am up against.
I thought Dockstader's program "designed" the gear.
My computer skills, or should I say lack of skill present an obstacle to competent use of the program
I have several steam books and a general understanding of the design .
So its back to the drawing board , and CAD program to layout the gear.
I will download the spreadsheet...I can work that !
I found the instruction sheet on the Bitter Creek website, but also get a 404 error there

Thanks for the help

Rich

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Dick_Morris
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Dick_Morris » Sat Aug 01, 2015 1:22 am

I don't know that CAD would have helped me during the design. I enlarged a drawing and penciled in the dimensions as they developed. I also did a mirror image of the drawing because it had the front to the left and I can only think with the front to the right! CAD came after I knew what the dimensions were.

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gwrdriver
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by gwrdriver » Sat Aug 01, 2015 8:22 am

Interesting Dick. I always conceive and make locomotive drawings better front to left. I'm in the same boat as Rich. I have a valve gear to design and although the process is presently suspended (to get another project out of the way) I'm having a difficult time getting my head around it. The drawings have been started though, front to left.
GWRdriver
Nashville TN

david griner
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by david griner » Sat Aug 01, 2015 3:40 pm

Here is some design information from Railway Mechanical Engineer:
Attachments
Walsh_ Design_40ec1b57.gif
Walsh_ Design_2fa6b23b.gif
Walsh_ Design_m5a0a236.gif
Walsh_ Design_m162261af.gif
Walsh_ Design_m5409148b.gif

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Fred_V
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Fred_V » Sun Aug 02, 2015 6:58 am

Great info but almost impossible to read. Any way to make it upload more clearly?
Fred V
Pensacola, Fl.

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Rich_Carlstedt
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Rich_Carlstedt » Sun Aug 02, 2015 1:45 pm

Thank you David !
What an awesome find.
I am working on the text right now and will report back.

Fred, I also had a difficult time reading it because its a gif file according to my photo reader
So I set out to find the original article
It is available free at the "ARCHIVE.ORG" website
https://archive.org/details/railwaymechanica91newy
Its on page 71 if you want the direct link
https://archive.org/stream/railwaymecha ... 1/mode/1up

To see the lineup of available reprints go here
https://archive.org/search.php?query=ra ... 20engineer
If you can save them as jpg's and reset the contrast in a photo publisher , the text appears much better

Thanks again Dave !

Rich

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Gary Armitstead
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Re: Help with Charlie Dockstader Program

Post by Gary Armitstead » Sun Aug 02, 2015 2:10 pm

Back in 1980 when I first started building my Gene Allen ten-wheeler, Willie Wilheim (member of LALS) was also just starting his ten-wheeler. He was designing Baker valve gear for that engine that was originally designed to use Stephenson gear! That was a sweet running locomotive! He used CAD to design it. It CAN be done. He was also a design engineer in aerospace. Not everyone can do this, I admit.
Gary Armitstead
Burbank, CA
Member LALS since 1980
Member Goleta Valley Railroad Club 1980-1993

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