Couple of Shorties

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ccvstmr
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Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

GETTING GLAZED AND THEN SOME

One interior item that hasn't been touched on yet, is the glazing installation. Purchased a 30 x 36" sheet of 1/16" acrylic plexiglass from Menards. Would you believe...we USED ALL OF THAT! When you consider the (2) shorties needed (64) windows total: clerestory and side windows and another (36) windows were needed for Honest Dave's cars...the plexi was used up fast.

To cut the plexi into the needed window sizes...the sheet of acrylic would be scored with a sharp shop knife. Not once, but sometimes as often as 8 or 10 times. Scribe marks were scored along the sheet edges. Used a long, stiff straight edge and another pair of hands to hold the straight edge while scoring the material. The sheet is then placed over a right angle edge. Sometimes used a backing board on top along the score mark, and then gave the scored piece a karate chop. If done well, you'll get a clean break along the entire edge of the glazing strip. And yes...those edges are sharp enough to draw blood.

The process was repeated until the window strips were scored and broke into the needed window sizes. The corners were nipped because the window castings did NOT have inside right angle corners. Before the glazing was installed...a shop knife was dragged across the scored edge to scrape off the burr. The protective film was removed on both sides and a blast of air used to try and blow off the shavings (damn static electricity).

Cut strips of 1/2" thick poplar and 3/4" poplar and planed those down to .100" to .125" thicknesses. The 1/2" wide strips were used along the upper edge of the side windows and the clerestory windows as glazing retainers. The 3/4" wide strips were used along the bottom of the side windows. In addition, purchased several packs of 1/16" x 1/4" basswood from Hobby Lobby. These were cut as needed for the window widths and glued to one edge of the poplar strips. The basswood is what really holds the glazing in the window frame recess. It's not a tight fit...just enough to hold in place.

Here's the window retaining strips being prepared with the basswood glued and clamped to the poplar strips.

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Both sides of the window retainers were painted. When the paint was dry, the car was set over on it's side. The glazing pieces were set in each window opening. A small bead of glue was run along the straight edge and pressed into position with the basswood strip bottoming out on the window cut out. Didn't want the window retainer visible when looking in from the outside. Weights were used to hold the retaining in place until the glue dried.

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Since these shorties are "utility cars", didn't see a need to "trim/frame" all four sides of each window. Should point out, used 1/2" wide poplar strips with the basswood for the clerestory windows as well. The coach received the same interior window treatment.

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DA BOX

From here, going back down-under for some underbelly details. For now, will touch on the tool box. Sierra Ry combine #5 had a tool box located between the queen post timbers. After scaling the tool box size from the magazine article line drawing...realized my timbers and queen posts were closer together. Believe this happened as a result of: these trucks being slightly longer than the real trucks and didn't have much space between the truck and the car floor. Best I could do was capture the "flavor" of the tool box.

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With the determining factor being the distance between the queen post timbers, glued/screwed some scrap pieces of 2x4 together. When the glue was cured...but the 2x4" maybe 3/8" shorter than the distance between timbers. Grabbed the 1/16" basswood with the 1/4" scribing and laminated the wood block with the basswood using the Elmers Max glue for the larger pieces. Weighted the block down. When the glue dried for each piece...sanded along the block edges before applying the next piece of basswood.

Used the 1/16" x 1/4" basswood from the window retainers to "frame" the tool box corners. This time, used superglue to secure the tool box corner edging. When the block was done...

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After painting the box with several coats of satin black and mounting to the car underside...here was the end result...

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But wait...there's still a couple more under car details to share. Will get into that next time. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
rkcarguy
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Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by rkcarguy »

You do amazing wood work!
ccvstmr
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Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

rkcarguy wrote: Thu May 14, 2020 10:18 am You do amazing wood work!
Thanks RK...but I will be the first to admit...I'm no cabinetmaker. But I can obviously glue 'n screw a couple pieces of wood together. Wouldn't call myself a machinist either. But I can whittle away at a piece of metal and make a pile of chips. Somewhere in there, is the part I need.

Was never my intent here to tell anyone HOW to build a passenger car. However, if they wanted to try their hand at some old time wood car construction, they can certainly use many of the elements presented...for any scale model.

Stay tuned...the end of this epistle isn't far away. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
Posts: 2230
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

UNDERSIDE EYE CANDY

Stirrup Step: viewers might have noticed in the last photo above, there's a stirrup step located off-center from the baggage compartment door. Once again, did my best to scale the stirrup. As soon as the stirrup was bent to shape, saw where fastening the stirrup into the wooden plank end grain or even the plywood skin underneath was not going to last long. Decided to add a mounting feet to the stirrups and get a screw into the plywood floor. Cut some brass squares and soft soldered the mounting feet to the stirrups. Based on the location of the mounting screw...if that penetrated the plywood floor...it would still be anchored in the wall frames above the floor.

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Like most other metal objects, before mounting...the stirrup steps were sand blasted and painted satin black to match the rest of the car underside.


Air Reservoir: on the side opposite the tool box on the #5 combine and on the #6 coach...is an air reservoir. Found somewhere the tank was 10" in diameter and about the same length as the tool box (the distance between the queen post timber supports). The air reservoir is located just inside the truss rods and somewhat visible from the side of the car. As such...wanted to include this detail on both of the shorty models. Here's a reservoir view on the #6 coach.

SRYC-6coach6.jpg

Rummaged thru the scrap bin and found a 1.25" diameter piece of aluminum tubing. Perfect size. The tube had an indentation on one side. This could have been the core from a roll up window shade in a former life. No matter, nobody will see the indentation if positioned at 12 o'clock. Had to bore out the indentations on the ends to fit the reservoir tank caps. Went back to the scrap bucket to find some aluminum rod that could be turned to fit inside the tube. That tube indentation would serve as a stop for the tank end.

The tank mounts were made from 1/2" aluminum channel. Just happened to have a 1.25" diameter end mill. Used that to carve the seat for the tube. Used the same end mill to cut the corners off the channel for mounting screw access.

One tank end for each reservoir was drilled and tapped for a 3/16 MTP fitting. At that time, didn't have any 1/8 fittings and didn't realize 1/8 fitting suppliers were ALMOST all gone. Found out later, Locoparts sells 1/8 fittings. Came out of the reservoir tank end with a short nipple, a 90 deg elbow and another short nipple.

Honest Dave was kind enough to provide some "drain cocks". Perhaps slightly oversized, but painted black and under the car...would still be acceptable...and easier to see too. Dave also provided some 3/32" TIG welding wire rod for the tank straps. If I recall...used 2-56 square nuts to secure the straps. And when it all came together...this is what was produced...

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From here...the reservoirs had a close encounter with the sand blast cabinet and then the rattle can with satin black paint. Next up, a model brake cylinder and brake valve. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
Posts: 2230
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

MORE EYE CANDY

Have another piece of "eye candy" decoration for the underside of the model #5 and #6. This fell into the..."let's see what we can do with this anyway" category. The reason for that...it's a detail that's not easily seen unless you stoop down on the opposite side of the car and take a look underneath. These were mounted behind the air reservoir. Talking about the brake cylinder and brake valve. Therefore, this really was an exercise to see what could be made.

Had an old school friend that after working for the Illinois Central RR, ended up at the AAR (Association of American Railroads). He became a subject matter expert on train brakes. Ended his career working at the DOT's FAST Track in Pueblo, CO where real time testing was done on trains running a circle track hour after hour. Well, "Fred" decided to cut off ALL the plastic cast brake details on his fleet of HO train models... and replace those with brass wire and other pieces to model the brake hardware. Once again...out of sight. But that's what he wanted. The same thoughts ran thru my head as I considered brake details for the model #5 and #6.

The Sierra #5 and #6 had what I believe is called a "K" style brake valve. The brake valve was mounted directly to the back of the brake cylinder...saved (1) piece of interconnecting pipe work. As brake valve technology evolved, the valve would eventually be separated from the cylinder. Was lucky to get a photo of the valve and a couple dimensions of the brake cylinder so the model pieces could be reverse engineered. Here's a photo of the brake cylinder and valve.

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With only a few known dimensions (and no actual drawings), had to guesstimate what the model dimensions would end up being for both cylinder and valve. Started with the brake cylinder. These were turned on the lathe using some alum rod.

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Seriously thought about adding nut and bolt details and decided to "pass" on that. Maybe in my next life. Once again, out of sight...out of mind.

Still, needed a way to mount the cylinder. Machined some 1/4" thick alum to attach to the cylinder. The cylinder end was drilled and tapped for the brake piston rod. When I showed the following photo to someone well versed in RR hardware. His response was something like..."Those brakes must be set up really tight!" Looked at the photo again and knew exactly what he meant. Realized the length of the exposed piston rod would indeed have set the brakes hard. The rods were removed and replaced with a short piece of 10-32 screw to eventually attach a clevis.

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The brake valve was starting to take shape. Started with a 7/8" piece of round brass since soldering pieces together would be part of the assembly. Used a rounded end lathe cutter since castings would have fillets for the inside corners...and rounded over the outside corners with a file. The back end of the valve was machined to 3/4" diam...the front of the valve machined to 1/2" diam. This was done so when the valve was parted-off, could still grab the ends of the valve for other operations. With the last operation being to machine a taper on the valve end.

Turning the brake valve parts in a 5C collet was a blessing as parts could be moved from lathe to mill in a 5C square block for various operations. Therefore, stuck with dimensions that could be grabbed with the collet.

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Would not call myself a air brake expert. Sadly, my old school friend, Fred, was longer available to consult with. As such, have no idea what the various parts of the valve were. Still, needed something to "hang" from the main valve body. Also made the clevis to screw on to the working end of the brake cylinder.

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Took the valve body back to the mill and machined a "flat" on the bottom of the brake valve body to provide a surface to solder the brake valve parts together. Machined a radius on the back end of valve too. Here's a close-up view.

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Next time, will start sticking various parts 'n pieces together for the entire assembly. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
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Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

EYE CANDY MOVING ALONG

After turning the parts for the brake valve, was time to stick the two pieces of brass together. Made a cradle out of scrap metal (aluminum in this case) to hold the valve for the soldering process. Believe I used a ball end mill down the length of the cradle and then cut a square slot across the cradle for the valve flange. With the heat directed at the brass parts, was not concerned about melting the cradle. A "3rd hand" was used to apply downward pressure and hold the add-on part in place to prevent movement during the soft soldering.

At some point, the brake valve was held with a 5C collet in the lathe on the front (right side as seen in photo) so a 4-40 hole could be drilled/tapped into the back end of the valve. This would be the fastener used to join valve to the cylinder. As long as standard collet sizes were used for the brake valve at both ends, there was a way to hold the parts for drilling/tapping in the lathe. The back of the valve was shaved "a couple thou" at a time, until the two parts screwed together in correct orientation. Then used Loctite to secure all the pieces.

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When soldering, wanted to apply enough solder to fill in the voids and create fillets at the joints. Excess solder could be removed with a rotating wire brush in a Dremel tool or similar. Knew before completion, the entire assembly would be sand blasted and then painted.

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The last valve machining operation was to grab the back of the brake valve (on the left) and machine the taper (on the right)...rounding over the end of the taper with a file.

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When the assemblies were completed, they looked like this.

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Here's a close up of the brake valve end.

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After a trip thru the sand blast cabinet to clean the parts and roughen the surface so the paint will have more "bite" on the metal surfaces, the parts were painted satin black. When the paint dried, here's how the finished detail turned out...

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Almost to the end. Next time, we'll get details mounted to the underside of the car. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
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NP317
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Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by NP317 »

Very creative and convincing details!

I'm in the middle of similar fabrication of King-type pneumatic sanding valves for placement on the sand dome sides. Non-working.
Very visible when mounted on the locomotive.
I'll add some pics and info to my own build blog when available.
I remain inspired by your work.
RussN
ccvstmr
Posts: 2230
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

NP317 wrote: Sun May 17, 2020 10:09 am Very creative and convincing details!

I'm in the middle of similar fabrication of King-type pneumatic sanding valves for placement on the sand dome sides. Non-working.
Very visible when mounted on the locomotive.
I'll add some pics and info to my own build blog when available.
I remain inspired by your work.
RussN
Thanks Russ. As you can imagine, there's a number of questions that run thru the mind...how far do I take something? ...will a part be visible? ...will the part need servicing? In the end, down to time, material, cost and...whether you can see and handle small parts! It's amazing how 2-56 screws keep getting smaller year after year. Those 0-80 screws...NOT going there!

Imagination is a wonderful think when looking for alternatives to create models and/or parts. Years ago, remember seeing a 2-8-0 loco at the train club with a fluted dome cover. Nice touch. Found out later, that was one-half of an old copper fluted toilet bowl float. The loco builder was a plumber by trade. Might be hard pressed to find floats like that today...unless you're in an old-time hardware store.

Another side to consider...what's the break point between fabricating parts or looking for other mass production means? The passenger car windows were one area where casting was better suited to generate the needed windows plus have a few spares. Your sander valves? Well, casting replication may or may not be warranted. One thing is for certain...Kozo's way of breaking parts down to basic shapes that can be screwed/soldered together is one way to reach a goal for loco and/or rolling stock construction projects.

Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
Posts: 2230
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

LAST OF THE EYE CANDY

With the brake valve and cylinder assemblies completed and painted, the last step of this process was mounting. The car bodies were flipped upside down on the work bench (on an old piece of carpet).

Mounting parts for the #6 coach model was a breeze. Simply screw the components to the underside of the plywood floor deck, between the queen post timbers and behind the truss rod turnbuckle. Components were arranged such that IF...interconnecting piping were modeled, at least the parts were oriented properly. AND...made sure the "B"rake cylinder was pointing towards the "B" end of the car.

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Encountered an obstacle when installing the details on the #5 combine model...the floor ventilation screen needed when carrying a propane fuel tank was in the way. To resolve this, built a trapeze or standoff bracket to attach both the reservoir and brake valve/cylinder to. Dipping into the aluminum scrap bucket, came up with some bar stock that was suited for the application and still maintain the basic mounting geometry for the components. Eventually, the component stand-off was sand blasted and painted before mounting.

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Stepping back, when the tool box was mounted under the #5 combine, had to modify the top of the box to straddle the screen mounting hardware as well.

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When the car was flipped right-side up, yes, was difficult to see the brake valve/cylinder...but had (what I thought) was a credible looking feature for those willing to bend down for a look into the dark recesses of the car underside. Here's a couple views...

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Next time, the cars take a short trip. Stick around for the ride. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
ccvstmr
Posts: 2230
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

MOVING DAY

For those of you that have been following this entire ordeal, you might recall the intent was "unveil" the shorties at the All American Train Show in LaGrange, IL on Saturday, March 21st. Didn't happen...as calls for shelter in place went out. The back up plan...move the shorties to the train club.

The previous Thursday, it was time to get the shorties out of the basement shop. Needed the shop space to get going on some passenger cars for Honest Dave. Lucky for me, at approx. 45 pound, the car bodies by themselves were still within my lifting and carrying capabilities. This restriction due to a bulging L5-S1 disk. The trucks were carried up to the garage (23 pounds ea) along with the roof (about 10 pounds) and couplers. Had my wife open/close door as I came up the stairs to keep the feline unit from getting places we didn't want him.

In the garage, had a couple folding plastic horses set up with a "ladder track". Cobbled the track together by ripping a 2x6 into strips. Had a few "cross ties" along the length and angled cross braces to keep the gauge from changing. The combine came up first. Sat the car on construction blocks on the track. Lifted each end of the car, removed the blocks and rolled a truck under the king pin. Checked the coupler height. If low, slipped another 1/32" thick Teflon washer between the car and truck bolsters. Once the height was okay, installed a 1/2" fender washer and "R" clip between the bolster and swing center to hold the trucks to the car...even when lifted for re-railing. The air brake lines were hooked up via the Clippard quick connectors.

A narrow piece of moving blanket was thrown over the car and a spring loaded lifting strap wrapped around the blanket to keep the roof in place during transit and rolled into the back of the Traverse. The procedure was repeated with the coach. Transport boards had a pocket at the head end to grab the coupler. A drop pin held the coupler against the inside of the pocket. Straps and bungees hold the car down to the transport board. Haven't had a car come loose yet. After both cars were loaded...they were ready for the 12 mile trip to the train club...and get their 1st glimpse of the outside world...even if that was a cold, over-cast day.

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After arriving at the train club, the hydraulic hoist makes an easy task of getting rolling stock unloaded. So, for those of you that have patiently waited to see the results of the work and at times frustration and aggravation (after making a nice pile of poplar saw dust under the table saw and around the shop floor)...here you go...

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The cars were rolled from the hoist to one of my assigned storage tracks. Along the way, stopped for a couple more pix.

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Think it's only fitting to close out this post with an old-time photo of the real #5 and #6 at Jamestown (year unknown). Come to think of it, haven't seen a recent color photo of the two cars together.

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From what I understand, the future for the #5 combine is questionable. Having been in some kind of service for nearly 120 years, time has taken its toll. Like so many things, restoration efforts take time and more importantly, money. Can only hope the former days of glory for #5 and #6 can be preserved for future operations at Jamestown.

Now, some of you might have thought the model #5 and #6 story ends here. Well, that's not exactly true. Will explain next time. Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
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NP317
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Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by NP317 »

Gorgeous! You must have been thrilled to see them rolling on your club tracks!
Thanks of sharing this journey...so far.
RussN
ccvstmr
Posts: 2230
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:37 am
Location: New Lenox, IL

Re: Couple of Shorties

Post by ccvstmr »

NP317 wrote: Wed May 20, 2020 2:07 pm Gorgeous! You must have been thrilled to see them rolling on your club tracks!
Thanks of sharing this journey...so far.
RussN
Thanks Russ for your comment and...you're welcome! Glad to share the journey. Have been building rolling stock for some 30+ years. Enjoy the building...enjoy the running...and enjoy doing operating sessions as well. Something else, there are times when I'll let someone else run the Rutland at the head end of a string of my cars. It's nice to see the years of efforts going down the track...even if I'm not the one at the throttle! Carl B.
Life is like a sewer...what you get out of it depends on what you put into it!
I don't walk on water...I just learned where some of the stepping stones are!
I love mankind...it's some of the people I can't stand!
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