Cross slide vise or table recommendations

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jameslbirke
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Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by jameslbirke »

I’d like to find a fairly good cross slide drill vise for $300 or less. It would have an X travel of 6 to 8 inches and a Y travel of 3 to 5 inches. I looked at a lot of them on the web but, many reviews mentioned warped adjustment screws and having only one bearing at the crank end rather than one at each end. Some of them had an adjustment to minimize the backlash of the nut. If it weighed less than 40 pounds, that would be a big plus.
Most of my projects are made of wood and this would be a big help when I needed to cut a slot in it or a thin sheet of aluminum.
I would appreciate it if anyone could suggest a brand name, supplier, and possibly a model number in that order?
Jim Birke
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Bill Shields
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by Bill Shields »

Never seen a new one that I felt was worth keeping...or purchasing.

Had a Palmgren that was WW2 vintage but tossed it out decades ago.

Keep in mind that most drill presses really do not like side thrust on their spindles...and the chucks really are not designed for side thrust either..so would not recommend purchasing one with the idea of creating slots using a drill press.

Maybe a small table top mill would be better a better selection.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.
whateg0
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by whateg0 »

For woodworking projects, I'd say most drill presses can handle the side loading that they would see. Depending on the species of wood used, the size and style of the router bit, etc, the side loading should be pretty minimal. The bigger issue I see, depending on the specifics of the projects and the accuracy required, is that some drill press spindles, and some drill chucks, have quite a bit of runout.

As far as the table goes, I wouldn't be too concerned about a bearing at both ends. As long as it has a good thrust bearing and someway to take up end play, a bearing at one end will be fine. It's not like you are going to be spinning the screw at 500 rpm. Depending on the build quality, having a bearing at both ends can actually make binding worse if they and the nut aren't aligned properly. The XY tables I've seen that I had considered in the past all looked like miniature milling machine tables. The cross-slide vises I have actually seen were all very cheaply made. Nothing about them said precision. There was a lot of slop in all moving surfaces. The screws were chrome plated forged or cast pieces. Again, nothing I would ever buy.

I don't know what kind of drill press you have, but some seem to be going for a premium. It might be worth looking into selling the drill press and buying a small drill/mill. That would get you the ability to put slots in your woodworking projects and still be able to use it as a drill press. The trade off would be in the throat depth. Until you start getting pretty big (for hobby use) you might be a little limited there.

Dave
John Hasler
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by John Hasler »

Side loading a drill press spindle risks loosening the taper and having the spinning chuck flung across the shop.

I have a Grizzly x-y table that looks like a miniature milling machine table. On the outsde. On the inside it looks like a cheap cross-slide vise. Took many hours of work to bring it up to barely useable.
whateg0
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by whateg0 »

John Hasler wrote: Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:18 pm Side loading a drill press spindle risks loosening the taper and having the spinning chuck flung across the shop.

I have a Grizzly x-y table that looks like a miniature milling machine table. On the outsde. On the inside it looks like a cheap cross-slide vise. Took many hours of work to bring it up to barely useable.
Understood, but again, depending on the wood being routed, there may be very minimal side loading present. Depending on the DP, it might not even be a concern. My old Craftsman 150 uses a taper, but also a retaining nut. Guess I should have said YMMV.

Dave
Lew Hartswick
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by Lew Hartswick »

One of these X - Y tables are good for locating holes accurately (That is why I have one) but for ANY slotting or edge finishing are of NO use with a drill press. You need a router an appropriate router table to those features. Router bits and milling cutters need more speed than any drill press big enough to be considered for that sort of work.
...lew...
earlgo
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by earlgo »

John Hasler wrote: Side loading a drill press spindle risks loosening the taper and having the spinning chuck flung across the shop.
One time long ago I set up a fly cutter in my drill press to face of a small chunk of walnut. The spinning chuck came loose and, as stated, skated across the table, and floor. I am just glad karma sent it off the back of the table.
It happens, be aware.
--earlgo
Before you do anything, you must do something else first. - Washington's principle.
pete
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by pete »

Not to be too negative and this might be a lot more than you were expecting. But most at the hobby level and I did as well at one time seem to have a false impression of the obtainable accuracy on any less than 1,000 lb non commercial drill press. Unless you actually check and properly measure the table deflection with an indicator it's almost impossible to get the idea across that no matter what you do, that table deflection is going to defeat getting any better accuracy even if you tram the table to the spindle perfectly. I had a 15" swing 16 spd and roughly 250 lb Craftsman floor model drill press that came from the factory with I thought an impressive less than .0015" run out at the chuck. I was extremely pleased with what I had until I learned enough to actually check how the table was deflecting under even light pressure. I could easily see at least .030" on the table front just applying maybe 30 pounds of hand pressure. I've read drilling a 1/2" hole in mild steel without a smaller starting hole can take upwards of 150 lbs of down feed pressure with a brand new sharp drill. Add to that variable work piece weight, clamps, vise etc and I finally gave up on even having any drill press my shop floor could support. For myself I figured out those consumer level DP's just couldn't ever do what I wanted one for and now use my Bridgeport clone for milling and all accurate drilling. That may not be an option for you, but that table deflection is still worth knowing about before getting too far into this.

Every new or even used precision industrial grade drill press I've ever seen weighs at least 1500 lbs and costs as much as an off shore Bridgeport clone. Unless you have one of the smaller bench top industrial models with a fixed base drilling platform there's literally no way around the built in design issues without a huge amount of redesign and added parts like a knee type table support screw. So adding even the best X,Y table only gains you accuracy in the X,Y positioning and nothing in the vertical Z axis alignment. If that's still tolerable to your requirements? Phase II make one for about your listed specifications. https://www.ebay.ca/itm/233998865132?ep ... SwwelglLZW However I have no personal experience of using one. When I had my last drill press I did add and still have the Craftsman brand of this one. https://www.ebay.ca/itm/114827515685?ha ... Swui1gr7oN It's ok at best and might also do what you want. Mine is now roughly 15 yrs old so I can't comment on the quality of the newer ones. But it also took a thorough cleaning and proper readjustments of the backlash and gib along with stoning rough edges to get it to even that ok for wood working status. Vertex is another brand you could search for that make X,Y tables and some well above your weight and price budget. Again I've not used any of them yet.

There are "some" DP's and keyed drill chucks that are mounted on an integral Jacobs taper on the DP's spindle that use a screw to retain the chuck on that taper. One of my smaller DP's used that system and while not ideal it could withstand some light side loading. Look inside your chuck with the jaws opened up and maybe you'll be lucky and find that. Without one and as others have already said, Morse Taper mounted arbors simply can't remain seated with those side loads. There just not designed nor meant to do so. Afaik no key less drill chuck made anywhere today can accept that center screw retention as it would destroy the chucks internals. With some keyed chucks it can be done, but you still need the integral Jacobs spindle chuck mount or a way of positively retaining the standard Morse Taper.

If this idea of yours came from watching or even reading about people using DP's as a cheap way of wood routing or even light milling you need to ignore them. It 100% can't and does NOT work ever for very logical and sound mechanical reasons. Anyone who's ever used even the cheapest mill with a drawbar and tool holding collets will know exactly why. My mill with it's VFD will top out at roughly 4500 rpm, that's still much too slow for woodworking router bits although metal cutting end mills will sort of do poorly to route slots in wood. You really need a wood routers 12,000 - 20,000 rpm to do better. With all this said an X,Y table can be helpful, but there's still built in limitations to properly understand before you even start spending your money.
LouStule
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Re: Cross slide vise or table recommendations

Post by LouStule »

Lew Hartswick wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:33 am One of these X - Y tables are good for locating holes accurately (That is why I have one) but for ANY slotting or edge finishing are of NO use with a drill press.
Absolutely agree. I have one on my drill press but only use it for hole locating. It woks good for that. Got it for $50 off Craigslist many years ago.
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