Boiler Testing

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NP317
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by NP317 » Thu Mar 11, 2021 10:33 pm

A thought on hobby boiler testing:
Regular "house" water pressure (30-70 psi) is sufficient to leak test a boiler, which is a primary function of a hydrostatic pressure test.
To test above normal operating pressure does not provide much more information, and as discussed here, provides possibilities for damage.
And often rolled tube joints can weep, and seal as soon as heat is applied.

These are considerations for not performing a 150% or even a 125% hydrostatic test on an annual basis.
And an annual steam test/inspection provides safety information on the appliances.
Washington State weighed our Hobby Boiler safety record and construction strength calculations (no recorded failures in State history), and decided we did not require State regulation, beyond the initial design/strength evaluation and the first 150% hydro test.
RussN

Glenn Brooks
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by Glenn Brooks » Fri Mar 12, 2021 2:22 am

Russ, great comment!

One point of clarification: the KLS safety study found no hobby boiler explosions anywhere in North America, since the beginning of Organized hobby activities... (not just in Washington State). There are a variety of documented failures across the US relating to poor maintenance and damage related to hydro testing.

Glenn
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Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge

Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....

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NP317
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by NP317 » Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:03 am

Glenn Brooks wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 2:22 am
Russ, great comment!

One point of clarification: the KLS safety study found no hobby boiler explosions anywhere in North America, since the beginning of Organized hobby activities... (not just in Washington State). There are a variety of documented failures across the US relating to poor maintenance and damage related to hydro testing.

Glenn
True Glenn.
I was a primary researcher on that investigation, preparing for KLS's presentation to the WA State Pressure Vessel Inspectors' 50th anniversary meeting 7(?) years ago.
I still have the Power Point presentation I gave them.

That's why I've asked if anyone has additional info to add!
Always on the search for improved data that the Live Steam Community can use to their benefit.
RussN

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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by Glenn Brooks » Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:16 am

Wow, very cool. Wondering if I am mistaken about findings about boiler explosion data. Can you confirm if it was Wa State, or National Wide? Ken mentioned it was nationwide...

Btw, when I first started researching a boiler replacement for my 1904 loco, I heard the 100 psi pressure standard in the National Code was Implemented in the late 1800’s in part due lighter materials practices and poorer metallurgy used in those days in boiler plate, than available today. Hence the lower pressure standard. any idea how valid that might be??

Thanks
Glenn
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Motive power : 1902 A.S.Campbell 4-4-0 American - 12 5/8" gauge, 1955 Ottaway 4-4-0 American 12" gauge

Ahaha, Retirement: the good life - drifting endlessly on a Sea of projects....

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NP317
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by NP317 » Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:27 am

Glenn:
Ken and I researched nation-wide. That was what went into our report.
RussN

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Bill Shields
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by Bill Shields » Fri Mar 12, 2021 3:23 pm

it really matters not what the reasoning behind a 'standard' from 1890 (or whenever).

a 'standard' it is what it is until such time as it is changed...that is why it is a 'standard'.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

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NP317
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by NP317 » Fri Mar 12, 2021 4:48 pm

Bill Shields wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 3:23 pm
it really matters not what the reasoning behind a 'standard' from 1890 (or whenever).

a 'standard' it is what it is until such time as it is changed...that is why it is a 'standard'.
And that is a reason Kitsap Live Steamers was willing to look carefully at our annual boiler certification methods,
and not be afraid to think in "new" ways that would better meet our needs.
RussN

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Bill Shields
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by Bill Shields » Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:22 pm

No argument...but there is always the possibility of legal problems if you stray away from a standard...and a huge legal bill...even if you win ...could destroy a club.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

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NP317
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by NP317 » Fri Mar 12, 2021 10:26 pm

Bill Shields wrote:
Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:22 pm
No argument...but there is always the possibility of legal problems if you stray away from a standard...and a huge legal bill...even if you win ...could destroy a club.
WA State has given their approval of our new certification procedure.
RussN

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Bill Shields
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by Bill Shields » Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:12 pm

Which is very good. Unfortunately it is a state by state challenge. Many states just do not want to know..others make life difficult.

Maryland poses some interesting challenges...even for gauge 1 steamers that do not have code safety valves....ot even two of them.

Fortunately the state inspector that I met (no names or places to protect the innocent) just totally avoided being around the gauge 1 track..taking the Sgt Schultz attitude of "I SEE NOTHING"...which is very reasonable.
Too many things going on to bother listing them.

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Dick_Morris
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by Dick_Morris » Fri Mar 12, 2021 11:26 pm

Unfortunately it is a state by state challenge.
A generation ago Minirails tried to take the lead on some national standards for the hobby. They got cut off at the knees by those who didn't agree that the standards were needed.

marshall5
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Re: Boiler Testing

Post by marshall5 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 4:49 pm

This is a link to the U.K. boiler test code https://www.sfmes.co.uk/ydrRoot/committ ... olume1.pdf
It seems to work fairly well for us. Hope it is of interest.
Ray.

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