Could I get tips on dumpster diving for materials for your build?

[Pontiacguy1]

Lots of people have 'repurposed' a lot of material over the years to turn it into a working steam locomotive. One guy in Texas built a working 2-4-0 narrow gauge locomotive on a budget of $20 per week. At least that's what I think I remember... It was a pretty low amount. He said that was all he could afford. He saved up and bought Allen Models mogul cylinders, but that's the only castings that he bought that I know of. He had access to a lot of scrap materials from dealers, and was patient about looking for items that would work properly. Took him about 2 1/2-3 years to have it finished and running, if I remember correctly. He was also retired, and had time and the skill to work from sometimes less than ideal items.

That being said: there are some parts where you are definitely better off using material of a known specification and quantity, such as in your frames, axles and running gear, drivers, bushings, pumps, rods, cylinders, and boiler, especially if you are a novice in metalworking and can't tell a bar of cast iron from a bar of A36 hot rolled. Items that are excellent to scrounge for and use repurposed materials for: Dome Covers, boiler jacket, cylinder covers, Cab parts, Reverse quadrant, any other ornamental or decorative parts, building cars, storage and transportation equipment/devices, etc...

[John Hasler]

>That being said: there are some parts where you are definitely better off using material of a known specification and quantity...

Yes, of course. I don't build locomotives, but I do buy new material when necessary.

[Bill Shields]

nor i - as long as you know what you are getting into the bucket.

been doing it for decades...

sure it has some ups and downs but with attention it can be a $$ saver.

[shild]

Before you go crazy dumpster diving, perhaps you should review the construction book for the Raritan that you are about to receive (or have received). It will tell you what all you need. You may find that you don't need as much material as you initially thought.

I agree, don't dumpster dive if you can help it. I have picked up many drops of metal from a friend's shop, sometimes for free, sometimes for scrap rate. One of the parts that this shop makes requires that they cut 5-6" diameter holes in 2" thick aluminum plate.... And this is done on a water jet. I pick up the slugs for next to nothing and keep them in my shop for various things!

Buy what you need so you know you have the right material on hand. You will need to pick up copper for the boiler for the Raritan - I don't think you want to experiment with "dumpster find" copper that is probably not to spec for the boiler. You will be able to find small drops of material for next to nothing if you look around, and properly befriend the right folks. Axle stock should cost you a few bucks. Frame material maybe twenty bucks, tops..

I will say that if someone kept coming to me saying they were going to go dumpster diving left and right for materials for their next build, when they are trying to build a new locomotive, I'd probably be a little less than enthused about helping out from a mentorship or a "pay it forward" aspect. But if I saw that you were being serious about your build - planning out all the materials you need, figuring out what tools you need, I might be more inclined to offer some material from my stock... I have lots of material, and doubt I will ever use it all - might as well go to someone who is in need of it.

That being said, I wouldn't immediately start trying to befriend folks on the forum - they'll probably see right through it. You have already been extended an olive branch in the form of a free raritan casting kit, don't burn that bridge. Others are unknowingly waiting in the toll booth lane to cross that bridge... It's up to you if you will wreck the bridge or re-pave the driving surface.

Take the time to read the build book, take the time to plan out all the materials you need, and start a thread about your new build. Maybe folks will see you're serious about it.

Yes, I am very excited about those castings on their way indeed! So far the tracking number says it hasn't gone far, so I'm working at other stuff for now. Do you think the 5/8", 1/2" and 3/8" rod you can get at Home Depot or Lowes would work for axles? Already have some of that. Been working at trying to make my lathes carraige stop so it's multiple stops. Been trying to find pictures with all the stages from people who already built a Raritan. I saw there is a build thread of someone else who is making a Raritan on here but looks like they didn't get too far.

[Greg_Lewis]

My experience with metal stock from the big box stores has not been good. I suspect it's from recycled metal; I've not found it to machine well. A favorite is 12L14, which is leaded stock, sometimes called "screw stock." It has lead in it and machines very nice. But it's hard to find other than round or hex and I would not use it where it is subject to wear. The common 1018 is fine and more readily available. 1018 also case hardens OK.

Grainger has about 200 locations around the country and they carry steel and brass. I haven't done a price check but they might be cheaper and more convenient than McMaster Carr, which we frequently reference here. And there is usually no problem with Ebay for metal as long as you read the description and insure that it is the alloy you want.

[John Hasler]

There are also online metal suppliers. I've had good luck with Speedy Metals. If you are in the upper midwest place your order by phone and ask that they ship via Spee-Dee Delivery. Faster and cheaper than UPS.

https://www.speedymetals.com/

https://speedeedelivery.com/

[Bill Shields]

They are very good...spwwdy and on line metals...and others.

The only problem is that cost of shipping often exceeds value of the product...but who said this is an inexpensive hobby?

I have success with scrap metal surplus warehouses for cold and hot rolled and some stainless. Forget brass..

[John Hasler]

>The only problem is that cost of shipping often exceeds value of the product...

Still cheaper than Menard's, though.

> Forget brass.

When I cleaned out my father's shop I gave away several hundred pounds of brass because I didn't want to haul it down here. A mistake I regret.

[Steggy]

Do you think the 5/8", 1/2" and 3/8" rod you can get at Home Depot or Lowes would work for axles?

Short answer is no. Much of that stuff is hot-rolled, of an unknown metallurgy and of an unknown origin. It's also absurdly expensive for what you are getting. I refer to it as...er...s**t steel because of its poor quality.

My go-to material for axles is Niagara LaSalle's StressProof® in TGP form (note that although StressProof is made from C1144, C1144 sold by other vendors is not StressProof). A good alternative is C1045 TGP. Both StressProof and C1045 machine well and can be handled in most lathes without any trouble.

A poor choice for axles is C1018, especially hot-rolled. C1018 doesn't produce a particularly good finish, unless ground, and the material is relative soft, making it undesirable for journal surfaces unless case-hardened.

Use the right materials for the job! Low-grade steel is fine for cosmetic items, but has no place in the machinery. Being chintzy about materials will likely cost you in the long-run when you discover your freshly-machined part is too soft, bends too easily, etc. On-line metal sources are your friend, as they can provide what you need at a reasonable price.

[Steggy]

The only problem is that cost of shipping often exceeds value of the product...but who said this is an inexpensive hobby?

Cost of shipping is affected by whether the destination address is commercial or residential. My shop has a commercial address, so I ship metals there, not to my home. Sometimes the difference in shipping cost between residential and commercial can be as much as 20 percent.

In any case, as John said, the total cost of ordering on-line is usually better than going to a hardware store or big-box emporium and getting metal of unknown characteristics at an inflated price.

[NP317]

When ordering your correct materials online, plan to include as many items in one order as you can.
Shipment costs are always less that way.
RussN

[shild]

Use the right materials for the job! Low-grade steel is fine for cosmetic items, but has no place in the machinery. Being chintzy about materials will likely cost you in the long-run when you discover your freshly-machined part is too soft, bends too easily, etc. On-line metal sources are your friend, as they can provide what you need at a reasonable price.

I'm confused about this one. Already learned first hand that if you try to machine something too hard, you'll put a lot of wear on the cutters and it will take a long time. But you say I could pick something too soft and it will bend? What are you talking about? If I made side rods out of aluminum?