Mill tooling

Discussion on all milling machines vertical & horizontal, including but not limited to Bridgeports, Hardinge, South Bend, Clausing, Van Norman, including imports.

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Lewayne
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by Lewayne » Fri Mar 27, 2020 8:58 pm

It’s a horizontal mill, I thought. I’m still having trouble posting pictures that’s why one went in twice. And if I hold the phone/ camera the wrong direction the photos Lay down . Still learning. If I click on them on my phone home they pop right up but don’t do that if they are wrong on my computer. Go figure. I kept getting intruded by the wife when I was posting earlier. I have a number of projects already lined to for the mill. Several parts for the lotus. I want to mill out slots on a piece of brass plate for a new floor register up in the apartment. I went to make tool holders for the lathe. The mill needs new hand wheels. Just stuff.

John Evans
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by John Evans » Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:26 pm

It is a vertical mill/drill !!!
www.chaski.com

Lewayne
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by Lewayne » Sun Mar 29, 2020 12:17 am

If you buy a collet adapter and collet set for the mill. R8 spindle, will those work on my South bend lathe as well. I suppose you would need a mt2 adapter ?

Harold_V
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by Harold_V » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:19 am

It is highly unlikely that you'll be able to use R8 collets where a #2 Morse taper is involved, as they are too large to fit in the existing hole.
Generally speaking, it is desirable to have collets that allow stock to pass through them for use with a lathe. That's not to say that some folks don't do so.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

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SteveM
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by SteveM » Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:49 pm

Harold_V wrote:
Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:19 am
Generally speaking, it is desirable to have collets that allow stock to pass through them for use with a lathe. That's not to say that some folks don't do so.
I have Morse taper 3 collets for my Atlas lathe. It's the only collet that will go directly in the spindle without a collet chuck that will hold up to 3/4" stock.

Downside, as Harold points out, is you can't send stock thru the spindle, but if you only need to hold a short piece of 3/4" stock, it's handy.

Other downside is that it may require more effort to get it out, as they are not self-releasing, like a collet with steeper taper (e.g. 5C, 3C, 3AT).

Steve

elewayne
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by elewayne » Fri Apr 17, 2020 11:43 pm

What collets work on an old south bend 9" lathe. What would be normal to use. I know i did know but I've forgotten.

John Hasler
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by John Hasler » Sat Apr 18, 2020 11:55 am

I have MT3 collets for my Logan but I also have a set of 3PN collets and an adapter sleeve that fits them to the MT3 taper.

spro
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by spro » Tue Apr 21, 2020 6:23 am

Yeah the lathes with MT#3 spindles. #4 was sort of weird with the old 11" South Bends. Rockwell 11s have a MT #3 in the tailstock.
Oh, the collets. depends upon that adapter. It is a really special piece of equipment. My South Bend 9A included the lever collet closer and box of 3C collets . It all works.

spro
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by spro » Wed Apr 22, 2020 5:18 am

The max of 3C is 1/2" for stock to pass right thru the tube and closure. Actual MT #3 collets are wider than that but really good chucks are better.

elewayne
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by elewayne » Thu Apr 23, 2020 6:17 pm

What the difference, in usage I suppose, between a normal R8 1/2" collet and an R8 1/2" tool holder adapter? It takes the bit and locks it in with a set screw on the flat.

Harold_V
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by Harold_V » Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:38 am

The tool holder projects the end mill farther away from the lower spindle bearing, and is reputed to run more concentric than a collet. Some folks swear by holders, while others, like myself, see no real advantage in holders, and prefer the more rigid setup of a collet. Please understand that in this case I am speaking of running light duty drop spindle mills (think Bridgeport, and BP type clones), not heavy duty CNC types, where holders are very desirable.

One thing that a collet allows is the end mill to move under the cut. Holders, assuming you've tightened the screws properly, avoid that problem. However, the problem is far more imagined than it is truthful, not that it can't happen. Here's the deal. So long as you understand what "tight enough" means on the machine drawbar, you can hold end mills adequately secured with a collet, even under a heavy cut. Frankly, it is highly unusual to have one move. That's especially true if one uses small end mills and never takes a serious cut.

My advice is to buy collets, not end mill holders. Others most likely won't share that sentiment, but you can hold pretty much anything with a shank size for each collet you own, while a tool holder may or may not permit that unless you don't mind damage on the gripped item. If you try holding soft items with the set screws, and the piece fits snuggly, the damage done by the screw may make removal difficult. You don't experience that with collets.

I do not recommend you, or anyone, buy both systems. A full set of R8 collets is not very expensive, and you are covered for most anything you may encounter. Holders are more expensive, and are somewhat limited, with the features discussed by many of no real consequence to the home shop machinist.

There's a real advantage in using collets if you do a lot of tool changing. By standardizing on a given shank size, you can switch from an end mill to a drill chuck by simply loosening the drawbar. That is a very desirable feature when you must make changes on a regular basis. If you make that your choice, I highly recommend you standardize on 3/4", for maximum gripping power and rigidity. Smaller diameter shanks are more troublesome, although that may not be an issue if you do nothing but small work.

As I said, that's my opinion. Others may not agree.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.

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SteveM
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Re: Mill tooling

Post by SteveM » Fri Apr 24, 2020 8:43 am

Harold_V wrote:
Fri Apr 24, 2020 1:38 am
There's a real advantage in using collets if you do a lot of tool changing. By standardizing on a given shank size, you can switch from an end mill to a drill chuck by simply loosening the drawbar. That is a very desirable feature when you must make changes on a regular basis. If you make that your choice, I highly recommend you standardize on 3/4", for maximum gripping power and rigidity.
Early on, and under Harold's recommendation, I made a straight shank drill chuck arbor in 5/8 (largest collet I had at the time) for my Pratt & Whitney mill.

I only need about 1" to drop the end mill out and swap to the drill chuck.

I don't have a quill, so for me, getting the room means raising and lowering the table and when the table height is 50 thou per revolution of the handle, it takes a while.

The shank doesn't have to be long. The collet doesn't grab much more than an inch of length anyway.

You can buy a new straight shank arbor and cut it off. Just check how much the collet can grip and cut it to give the most grip.

Steve

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