ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

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ARGENG
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Location: Melbourne Australia

ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by ARGENG »

Hi Gang,
Is anyone familar with the ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe, I have just acquired one but have not moved it home yet so I am not to sure of its age, it was advertised as a tool room lathe. It is badged OMNITOOL not OMNISPEED, may have 50mm spindle bore, 48 to 4000 rpm. I wasn't game to run it at top speed when I went to ckeck it out, at 2600 it was humming along, for me this is quite a step up from my LeBlond 13'" which only runs to around 600 rpm. There is nothing about this model on the Uk.Lathes site.
Regards
Bruce
spro
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by spro »

Well first, Welcome ! No doubt you will receive more info. I'm wondering why it is "omni". 50mm is big stuff to me and it is likely a machine that will cause some interest. I'm terrible about posting pics or links so cannot be a hypocrat(sp). I think any link which would lead us to the general design would be of interest and also towards discovery.
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GlennW
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by GlennW »

Is it a turret lathe?

Omni (Omnitool) is a supplier of turret tooling and also makes machines. I have their catalog here...somewhere...but can't find it right now.

It's a possibility.
Glenn

Operating machines is perfectly safe......until you forget how dangerous it really is!
ARGENG
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:41 pm
Location: Melbourne Australia

Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by ARGENG »

Hi there,
It isn't a turret lathe.
The only photos I have are from the sale ad and they are not the best, when I get the unit home I will post some. I think the OMNISPEED and OMNITOOL basically look the same, the T bar on the front of the head has 3 positions, it has 380mm shown on it, I figure this is the swing, and the lever on the top of the head has A, B, C, D used with the T bar for speed selection.
The spindle is driven by a toothed belt, which from memory is about 75 mm wide, from the gear box in the head. This sort of makes sense for a high speed tool room lathe where you are trying to minimise vibration transfer from metal gears. I didn't think there would be lathes of this vintage with a 50 mm bore that would go to 4000 rpm. The lead screw needs investigating as when it is engaged at the g/box it rotates ok but when I engaged the half nuts it stops, there might be a clutch of some sort at the g/box or possibly a stripped gear, that is unlikely as the shaft does rotate.
The spindle is I think a D1-6, I can not see me needing to run it up to the full 4000rpm, both chucks are Elliott branded. There is a small knurled knob on the side of the apron and a square headed shaft on the front of the apron on the right of the cross slide dial, both I have no idea about.
As the apron has a oil flow indicator I am assuming it is lubricated from within? fill from?
Are the feed clutches in the apron?
Elliott.JPG
There is a taper attachment but I am not sure if the shaft that attaches to the clamps is there, the clamps are in the assorted bits and peices under the bed. If I can attach the photo I took on my phone when I looked at it things may make more sense to what i am trying to explain.
Cheers
Bruce
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ARGENG
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Location: Melbourne Australia

Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by ARGENG »

Well got the lathe home yesterday, it wasn't quite as straight forward a move as I was anticipating. Due to my driveway sloping and curving then leveling out the tilt slide tray would not actually come all the way to the ground. After much re-positioning and cursing finally got it off by running it onto some pipes and then playing with timber blocks and a lage pinch bar. Luckily the guy doing the move was a good bloke and persisted and stuck at it until we had the lathe up on the level section. others would have said, have fun and then unloaded at the bottom of the driveway.
I pulled the top cover of the headstock off last night and all the internals look fine, the spindle being about 52 mm bore really makes for a big piece of gear.

What I need to find out is how much gear oil and what type should go in the head stock, there is a well at the back which has the pump for lubrication off the bottom. Oil is pumped up to a distribution plate which has drip holes and copper lines going to the bearings. Because of this pumped lubrication I am guessing that the entire box does not need filling, probaly only the well reservoir.
The same for the thread/feed gearbox, how mmuch oil to what level and the same for the apron.
All three have sight windows with a revolving cog.

Any thoughts from the group would be much appreciated.
Regards
Bruce
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Harold_V
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by Harold_V »

I'm not the least bit familiar with the make, but I'm favorably impressed by what I've read, and in particular by the width of the carriage. A sure sign that it's a quality machine. I'm green with envy!

Enjoy.

Harold
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
spro
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by spro »

I'm with you, Harold, glad he posted these pics. This is quite a different lathe.
ARGENG
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by ARGENG »

Thanks guy's,
Yes I am very happy so far, as I clean up and get all in order I will post some more pics. I also picked up some great tooling that suits this size lathe at a very reasonable price.
Regards
Bruce
Hopefuldave
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by Hopefuldave »

Nice bit of kit, quite fancied an Elliott myself... Does the feed chart show the same feed-rates for cross and long feed like my Holbrook, so it'll turn a 90-degree included angle if you engage both? If it shows different feeds, do a bit of trig, you may find it's more useful than that and gives you a 60-degree included cone :) Once you've done the sums, remember you can add/subtract the taper attachment setting too!

It looks very very similar to the Omnispeed and the earlier "Cardiff" lathes - I have a feeling I may have an Omnispeed / Omniturn operation and/or service manual somewhere, I'll have a rummage and see whether a) I can find it and b) the scanner can do it justice?

The knurled knob on the side of the apron *could* be a pump one-shot oiler for the ways/cross-slide/half-nuts - certainly my Holbrook has one at the bottom of the apron on the right...

If the square-headed "bolt" is actually in the cross-slide screw bearing housing (couldn't make it out in the pic) it *could* be either a quick-withdraw (common on toolroom machines) or the lock for one - some of 'em have a quick thread in the bearing housing that acts before the screw starts moving the cross-slide I think? My Holbrook's moves the bearing about 3/8" back and forth in the housing for the quick-withdraw, YMMV. Put a spanner on it and see?

The leadscrew has a shear pin at the gearbox end - if this has sheared it'll give exactly these symptoms: the leadscrew will turn at a rate to match the selected thread tpi, but stops as soon as the half-nuts are engaged... with 'em disengaged, the friction in the leadscrew collar's enough to turn the screw, but once engaged...

The shear pin should be visible in the collar, tap it out with a punch (from the small end if it's tapered!!!) and if it comes out in three pieces... Don't be tempted to put a piece of "decent steel" in there, brass or bronze is a Much Better Idea as it's there to protect the lathe in a disaster!

EDIT: the http://www.lathes.co.uk/elliott page shows the earlier Elliott/Cardiff lathes, very very similar! The knurled knob could (looking at the position) cam the thread indicator dial in and out of engagement with the leadscrew - I've seen a couple that do that, not sure why unless it's to "index" it to line 1 where you want to start threading?

Just my ha'pennorth,
Dave H. (the other one)
Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of Wise Men - Douglas Bader
Richard_W
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by Richard_W »

I admit I was pretty impressed until I read that it only has a 2 bearing spindle instead of a 3 bearing spindle. Also there is no T slot on the compound which limits tool holding positions.

Richard W.
ARGENG
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by ARGENG »

Hi Dave,
Thanks for posting, that's cleared up a few things. I think the square head shaft on the front of the saddle locks the cross slide , the bolt head on top of the saddle locks the sliding movement, maybe there is mention of this in the manual. I didn't know that it might be possible to engage the sliding and cross feeds at the same time. I had seen it on a Monarch though, I will have to try it on the Elliott.
On my Le Blond you can only have one or the other.
The Knurled knob I am not sure about yet, it screws off a shaft which has clearance in the side of the apron, in the end of the knob there is an oil inlet, as yet I have not been able to get the thread indicator dial to engage with the lead screw, on another forum a member has indicated that screwing it in engages to the lead screw, maybe I haven't tried hard enough yet. I can see no obvious way to engage it to the lead screw so it is quite possible that the knob cams the indicator into the lead screw. On The Le Blond it pivots in.
If by chance you have a manual that would be fantastic and a great help.
Regards
Bruce
Funny thing my wife said, what lathe were you unloading, I said, remember I said I was going to look at one. He He
Hopefuldave
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Re: ELLIOTT OMNITOOL MT 48/4000 Lathe

Post by Hopefuldave »

If it's anything like the earlier Cardiff lathes, the spindle runs in twin opposed precision taper rollers at the front and a parallel roller race at the rear - the pulley may be in its own bearings and keyed/splined to the spindle like a Holbrook's if you're lucky?

That looks like a Multifix toolpost in the pic - if so - Ooh, nice! I hope you got a selection of holders, they can be Spendy!

I'll have a dig on Monday, see whether I have the book or not :)

Dave H. (the other one)
Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of Wise Men - Douglas Bader
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