Alternative Lubricants for Watch Movements

[ctwo]

I got the watch bug but it's a minor case at the moment. I bought a new Chinese movement of a Swiss design and later found out that they do not lubricate the movement.

The oils are more expensive than the movement!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/373352940587?_ ... BM6tzirrhf

I also bought a couple antique relics, a Centre Seconds Chronograph and Arnex Swiss in a hunter case.

Two main oils are needed:

https://www.moebius-lubricants.ch/sites ... 4_en_1.pdf

https://www.moebius-lubricants.ch/sites ... 0_en_1.pdf

plus a Lithium type grease which I think SuperLube will suffice.

It's said that the aforementioned oils have magical properties such that they stay put and repel dirt/grime, so matching viscosity is not enough. I was thinking of a 10W30 and heavy gear oil, synthetics...

Any thoughts on that?

[Bill Shields]

I have whale oil based lubes from 60 years ago, so am unfamiliar with the current alternative offerings.

Were they mine I would use only what the manufacturer recommends.

Stay away from motor oil.

You want lubricants that will stay out and not run away. Motor oils do not qualify.

Under no circumstances use WD40

[pete]

I'd very much agree with Bill about using the correct recommended lubrication. And besides the problem of using the incorrect lube, over oiling might be just as bad or worse. I've seen a few videos by people that know what there doing where either a tooth pick, dress makers pin or needle was used to apply a lot less than one drop of oil and in the exact place it was wanted. Racks and pivot points on dial indicators as one example. And in comparison watch movements have very little power, so minimizing drag from the oil type and viscosity is ultra important. You also want what's known as a non drying oil which I'd assume those more specialized oils are already formulated to be. The more common lubes don't have anything like it because it's not required.

For initial cleaning and without already having something like a proper ultra sonic cleaner, I think I'd probably use CRC Electrical Contact Cleaner. It's the very best I've found that strips off old oil and dirt, drys almost instantly and leaves zero residue.

[SteveM]

Under no circumstances use WD40

I tend to use that philosophy in all circumstances.

Steve

[ctwo]

I've been wasting lots of time watching watch repair videos. Am familiar with the process, just not finding justification for $100 on the specified oils that I'll use almost none of...

Here is technical note: http://horotec.ch/file/TECH_ETA.6497-1.pdf

At 40:30 he starts oiling the escapement jewels. I think he used too much.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnh7O22mduE


Some have said you can get away with Novostar 17313 for most of the movement and then a lithium grease for the other parts.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/264298860883?h ... SwV5lazGlv

It doesn't seem right though because the Novostar viscosity is 89 where the ascribed Moebius oils are 150 and 1250 (cSt = mm^2/s)!

[10KPete]

There are two schools of thought on drying vs. non-drying oils. The "drying" oils evaporate, slowly, and aren't supposed to leave any residue. The "non-drying" oils do not evaporate much but tend to gum with age.

The drying oil will allow the watch to continue to run after the oil is no longer lubricating, thus wearing the parts. The non-drying oil will gum and stop the watch. Thereby saving the wear parts and indicating the need for service.

It takes me about 3 hours to do a simple service on a pocket watch, like a 1890's Waltham. That's complete disassembly, cleaning, inspection, reassembly and oiling. I use the Mobius Synth. oils on mine as I'm not likely to try to run a watch that hasn't been serviced in a while. Forgetful folks will like the natural oils.....

Most qualified watch repairers seem to have shop rates around $100 or so. So $300 plus any parts and that seems to be a good price for a proper job.

Most folks have trouble paying as much for the service as they did for the watch! A mechanical watch, if used daily, will require service every year.

That's why I have to service my own: self defence!

Unless you have some known good reference for comparison, beware of the uboob practitioners as many take bad shortcuts.

Pete

[ctwo]

Thanks, Pete!

I had two ideas with this topic: one that an experienced watchmaker would chime in, and two that an experienced oil industry expert would chime in.

I find it hard to believe that there is a unique oil for a small market, one which is owned by Swatch, that isn't serviced by the much larger oil industries. Perhaps the clean evaporating oils do not serve the bulk market very well.

If I can go through that Centre Seconds Chronograph in a bit more than a day, I'd be impressed (it's kind of a basket case). I don't make a bill/hour, so it will be for fun. That's what it's all for anyway.

I do want to give one of the new movements as a gift, and machine a custom case.

[Harold_V]

Under no circumstances use WD40

I tend to use that philosophy in all circumstances.

Steve

It works quite well for machining aluminum and it smells one hell of a lot better than kerosene.

H

[Bill Shields]

Al long as the parts you make do not go into watch movements

[ctwo]

I had an eventful morning. I wanted to get an old Centre Seconds Chronograph ticking that I just got off ebay. I took off the balance and immediately dropped one of the screws that holds the jewel onto the floor (that hole is stripped). Fortunately it was picked up by a magnet. It's literally the size of a small grain of sand. I cleaned up the escapement works and put it back together, fiddled around with it for an hour, tweaked the hairspring back into place, and now it's been ticking for an hour. I used a proprietary mix of ATF and beeswax to lube a few of the pivots.

https://i.imgur.com/83XBAFc.png

https://i.imgur.com/zu44Cpv.png

[RSG]

Great info ctwo!

I have slowly gained a fascination with watch movements as well and with Tourbillions in particular. As such am attempting to build my first Tourbillion movement in a larger scale in the back of one of my fishing reel designs, for nothing more than a show piece. I've been working on it here and there for the last 3 years. I've got all the main body parts machined but now I have to get to the nitty gritty of the movement.

[NP317]

I wonder what lubrication is planned for the 10,000 year ("Long Now") clock being built?

https://longnow.org/clock/

I actually saw one of the 6 foot (2m) diameter stainless steel gears nearing completion at a Seattle, WA, USA, company about 10 years ago.
A massive and fascinating project!
RussN