Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Topics include, Machine Tools & Tooling, Precision Measuring, Materials and their Properties, Electrical discussions related to machine tools, setups, fixtures and jigs and other general discussion related to amateur machining.

Moderators: GlennW, Harold_V

User avatar
Harold_V
Posts: 20231
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by Harold_V »

rmac wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:58 pm I'll try to post a video of it running if I can figure how to do that.
Videos can't be posted on the board, but they can be linked if posted elsewhere. Youtube, as an example.

Beautiful piece of work, Russ.

H
Edit: I took a look at the link provided for stainless wick. Looks like it's just stainless aircraft cable.
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
User avatar
rmac
Posts: 787
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:48 am
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by rmac »

rmac wrote: Might be worth experimenting by just twisting together a bunch of wire to approximate the Kontax wick.
Well, well. That worked too good. Way too good! I unraveled six or seven pieces of #12 stranded copper wire and then twisted them back into a 1/4" diameter cable that would fit into the alcohol burner. For whatever reason, the alcohol wicked up the wire, spilled over onto the top of the burner lid and then onto the wood base. Before I knew it, I had one heck of a fire going. I need to play around with the whole thing some more in a setting where I'm not so likely to set the house on fire.

lid.jpg
Harold wrote: Videos can't be posted on the board, but they can be linked if posted elsewhere. Youtube, as an example.
Yes, I've seen that mentioned here before. My problem is that I've never before gone through the exercise of taking a video, getting it from the phone (or whatever) to a computer, editing it, and then uploading it to the internet. Guess it's time to learn all that so I don't wind up being the last guy on the planet who doesn't have a YouTube channel.
Harold wrote: Beautiful piece of work, Russ.
Thank you.

-- Russell Mac
User avatar
rmac
Posts: 787
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:48 am
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by rmac »

rmac wrote: For whatever reason, the alcohol wicked up the wire ...
Well, not quite. As it turns out, the alcohol wasn't "wicking up the wire", it was being pushed up through the wire by pressure building inside the burner as everything heated up. I put a little vent hole in the lid and that solved the problem. The wire wick seems to work really well so far. The burner makes an almost invisible blue flame with no smoke and plenty of heat to run the engine. And of course the wire itself doesn't burn at all. All good.

-- Russell Mac
pete
Posts: 2518
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:04 am

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by pete »

Felt might work?
User avatar
Harold_V
Posts: 20231
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 11:02 pm
Location: Onalaska, WA USA

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by Harold_V »

pete wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 10:21 pmFelt might work?
Assuming it's wool felt, yeah, it would work, although wool doesn't burn well. It would present some of the same problems that cotton does, so there's likely little benefit in trying. I am VERY familiar with wool and how it burns, thanks to having processed wool carpets to extract precious metal values.

Felt is also made from synthetic materials, most of which burn like gasoline when heated. Learned that from processing carpets, too.

H
Wise people talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something.
pete
Posts: 2518
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:04 am

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by pete »

Yep I should have been more specific, I did mean wool felt and not the synthetic variety.
User avatar
rmac
Posts: 787
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:48 am
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build - We Have Video!

Post by rmac »

To kind of close the loop on this, I made a video of the engine running and got a buddy to post it to his YouTube channel. Here's the link:

https://youtu.be/95z_860ozsQ

In case anybody is interested, I also made a care package that includes the Fusion 360 file, 2D drawings of all the parts, some photos of individual parts, and some miscellaneous notes. Look for it here:

http://www.ibab.org/tsdblog/manson_iii_plans.zip

Thanks to everyone for all the interest and help!

-- Russell Mac
User avatar
NP317
Posts: 4557
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:57 pm
Location: Northern Oregon, USA

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by NP317 »

Successful!
RussN
RSG
Posts: 1541
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:59 am
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by RSG »

Very cool Rmac 8)
Vision is not seeing things as they are, but as they will be.
pete
Posts: 2518
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:04 am

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by pete »

Very cool & shiny, but your on a slippery slope Russell. Most who get into these engines seem to slowly end up making them more and more complex with more and more exotic and expensive materials. Then there's just how slow they can be made to run, that's a nice set of design and engineering problems right there. Afaik NASA did a huge amount of experimentation with this engine type. I haven't checked, but I'd be surprised if there findings weren't accessible by the general public with a bit of digging.
User avatar
rmac
Posts: 787
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:48 am
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by rmac »

RSG wrote: Very cool ...
pete wrote: ... and shiny
Thanks, guys. pete, you're right about the slippery slope. In my brief career making these things I seem to discover potential improvements about 3/4 of the way through the construction process, after it's too late to actually incorporate them. Right now I have the piston/cylinder assembly left over from attempt #2, and it only makes sense do something with it, perhaps with a bigger flywheel.

And then the current model has a vibration that I think is just due to the piston assembly moving back and forth. So how about a horizontally opposed, two cylinder version arranged so the pistons move in opposite directions?

And then it would be interesting to play with counterweights and such to perfectly balance the flywheel/connecting rod system.

And then ...

-- Russell Mac
User avatar
GlennW
Posts: 7284
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2007 9:23 am
Location: Florida

Re: Manson Hot Air Engine Build

Post by GlennW »

rmac wrote: Sat Dec 11, 2021 6:44 am Thanks, guys. pete, you're right about the slippery slope. In my brief career making these things I seem to discover potential improvements about 3/4 of the way through the construction process, after it's too late to actually incorporate them.
Experience is something you get right after you really needed it!
Glenn

Operating machines is perfectly safe......until you forget how dangerous it really is!
Post Reply